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Moderator
Berlin, Germany
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Mar 2001 time: 23:26
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Our famous cafe after 3 years of successful service needed a renovation. Yeah those 500 post made it necessary. But we are back in time to celbrate my birthday and still here at Apolyton avenue and CtP2 Source Code boulevard corner, downtown.
We are just bigger and better with new jokes, crazy stories and lot of fun. 
You can bring your own coffee, cookies, beer and whiskey and those crazy stuff.
This cafe has been named after our currently most active member:
E
That's a nice ambiguity, isn't it. 
To remind you why this thread exists :
You can post here, anything that you shouldn't post in this forum, generally everything straightly unrelated but related some how with this community and its residents. Do not post news and events from around the world. There is a more appropriate forum for this sort of things: Off-Topic
The purpose of this thread is to have a break, some chat & fun and get familiar to each other. 
Note that the Apolyton Forum Rules apply here as well so avoid spam, troll or flame of any kind and behave well 
Have fun 
Related threads
GENERAL: CtP2 Source Code Cafe
GENERAL: Cafe "Tamerlin" II
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Prince
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Jun 2003 time: 22:26
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Nice to see everyone at the brithday party!Hope you have many more to come.
Peter Triggs posted in the other Cafe thread.Would be great to have him come back again.His Conquest mod is still one of the best at movement of AI units when at war.Even sea and air units which was always a weakness of the AI.
Also has the Coup De'etat code which would be perfect for the playtest build.Weaker civs would join stronger ones and would make for tough end game face off with the AI.
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Emperor
Monterrey, Mexico
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Jun 2001 time: 16:26
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quote: Originally posted by Protra3211
Nice to see everyone at the brithday party!Hope you have many more to come.
Peter Triggs posted in the other Cafe thread.Would be great to have him come back again.His Conquest mod is still one of the best at movement of AI units when at war.Even sea and air units which was always a weakness of the AI.
Also has the Coup De'etat code which would be perfect for the playtest build.Weaker civs would join stronger ones and would make for tough end game face off with the AI. |
I agree, I really like some of the things Call to Conquest mod does. I don't think it uses Frenzy AI to group units and attack either does it?
The only thing I didn't like was the fairly bland maps, but I understand this was to help the AI build/develop cities in good terrain all the time, as it spaces them so far apart.
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Emperor
Monterrey, Mexico
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Jun 2001 time: 16:26
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Here's what seems to be the main merge civ code:
code: /////////////////
//
// Merge Civ
//
// original idea: Lou Wigman
//
// original scripting: The Immortal Wombat (aka Ben Weaver)
//
// adapted for CTC by PT
//
/////////////////
void_f CTC_MergeCivs(int_t CivOne, int_t CivTwo, int_t CivOneUnitCount, int_t PWtotal){
// give civ one assets to civ two
int_t i;
int_t RiotLevel;
int_t HapBoost;
int_t CivOneCityCount;
int_t CivOneUnitType[];
city_t tmpCity;
city_t CivOneCity[];
unit_t tmpUnit;
location_t tmpLoc;
location_t CivOneUnitLoc[];
// re-init CivOneUnit arrays?
for (i=0;i 0){
if(Random(9)<1) {//include random chance of quicker merge
DoMerge=1;
}
}
if (DoMerge){
if (player[0].owner == MERGE_SOURCE){ //so MERGE_SOURCE must still be alive
if (IsPlayerAlive(MERGE_TARGET)){
DisableMessageClass(180103);//disable conquered by message
player[1]=MERGE_TARGET;
message(CTC_THE_CONQUERER,'CTC_ImportantNewsComing
In');
EnableTrigger('CTC_MergecivExec');
}
}
}
if (player[0].owner == CTC_THE_CONQUERER){//decrease count every time CTC_THE_CONQUERER has a turn
MERGE_COUNTDOWN=MERGE_COUNTDOWN-1;
}
if (MERGE_COUNTDOWN <0){ //shut down
CTC_THE_CONQUERER=0;
MERGE_SOURCE=0;
MERGE_TARGET=0;
EnableMessageClass(180103);
DisableTrigger('CTC_MergecivCheck');
// here's the place to check to see if we want to do another one
}
}
alertbox 'CTC_ImportantNewsComingIn' {
Title(ID_BREAKING_NEWS);
Text (ID_ImportantNewsComingInTxt );
Button(ID_BUTTON_CLOSE){
Kill();
}
}
HandleEvent(EndTurn) 'CTC_MergecivExec' pre {
int_t CivOneUnitCount;
int_t PWtotal;
int_t numAI;
int_t i;
if (!IsHumanPlayer(player[0].owner) ){//aborted if SLIC reloaded
player[1]=MERGE_TARGET;
PWtotal = player[1].publicworkslevel;
PWtotal = PWtotal + player[0].publicworkslevel;
CivOneUnitCount=player[0].units;
numAI=0;
for (i=1;i
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Prince
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Jun 2003 time: 22:26
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I was giving Hearts of Iron 2 Doomsday version a try.Not a bad game.Many mods are in the works .
Also have Supreme Ruler 2010.Very deep game and learning curve is so steep its taken more time to get thur then reading War and Peace.Not Call to Power by any means but does have many features found in civilization games.
Im thinking of using the merge code in the playtest to see if it works.Well look over the Conqust read me files.
There may be other features involved that allows the code to work right.
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Prince
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Jun 2003 time: 22:26
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On vacation for two weeks.Time to catch up on my reading.But of course will be giving the latest build 748 a try.
I have noticed Dale,s mod work too and wonder if Civ4 is worth giving a chance.The thing is CtP2 allows for a large map with many AI factions without putting a strain on your computor.From what I have gleaned from many threads is you need a least a gig of ram along with high end video card or you have problems playing Civ4.
Im not to far from those specs its a matter time before I upgrade.
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Emperor
Monterrey, Mexico
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Jun 2001 time: 16:26
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Have you used Dale's combat mod? I haven't because it's never likely to catch on for multi-player.
Combat is by far my biggest gripe with Civ4. I play Warlords for short intense periods but get bored, frustrated or annoyed with combat eventually.
So it's mainly the combat that keeps me playing CtP2. The random map AI can be annoying with the playtest and I don't have the time or inclination to improve it myself, so I've been sticking to creating specific scenarios and teaching the AI to follow very specific roles, which is actually quite satisfying as you can get results quite quickly.
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Emperor
Monterrey, Mexico
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Jun 2001 time: 16:26
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quote: Originally posted by E
THe other thing is the worker tedium, having to move those things around and supervise tehm so they don't screw up in automation, gets rid of the custom feel I get when I use PW. If the gold thing works out it may mean more to build my infrastructure, which I like - but we'll have to see. |
I usually automate just before the modern age (if i get that far). As all they need to do then is hook up the trade network on any new resources i get. I might interrupt a few to build workshops later on though.
quote: Any objections if I clean up the CTP2 interface to have the golden CTP1 colors? |
I would object, although I probably prefer the CtP1 colours as well, it's not what CtP2 was intended to be. I felt the same about some of CtP1 terrain, but again it's not really what CtP2 is, and we would be throwing away the original CtP2 material to go backwards, which is a shame.
quote: The tough part of it all is that there is this gap between ctp2 and civ4. I don't have the coding skills to add PW and combat to Civ4 and I don't have the skills to fix the AI in CTP2 |
Well we do have a decent AI for CtP2, it's just wrapped up in various mods, which I get the feeling is where it's going to stay. But after all the original intention of the source code was only to fix bugs and improve moddability. If we can get Ages of Man (hopefully some other mods as well) working with the playtest and all bugs ironed out I'd say it's good enough.
quote: If anything I promise to be hear until the fourth anniversary of source code release (Oct '07) |
Do we know what Martin G is up to? If it looks like the code will stop being worked on soon (for whatever reasons), I suggest we try to wrap things up ASAP.
As long as I'm visiting Apolyton I'll be around, but of course I don't contribute as much, certainly not to coding.
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E
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Emperor
Proud member of the CTP2AE coding team :)
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May 1999 time: 14:26
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quote: Originally posted by Maquiladora
I usually automate just before the modern age (if i get that far). As all they need to do then is hook up the trade network on any new resources i get. I might interrupt a few to build workshops later on though.
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That doesn't work for me, often i just see the workers hanging out in my city..damn drifters 
quote:
I would object, although I probably prefer the CtP1 colours as well, it's not what CtP2 was intended to be. I felt the same about some of CtP1 terrain, but again it's not really what CtP2 is, and we would be throwing away the original CtP2 material to go backwards, which is a shame.
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based on the condition of ctp2 I'm sure anyone knows what it was intended to be I won't be reverting back to ctp1 I was planning on using that color scheme to make new ggraphics, using stuff we see in current games like civ4 and civcity:rome where there is a fade in the buttons and stuff like that. On one hand I can do it and see what people think (by making it a mod) on the other hand if its not wanted I'm not going to expend the effort.
quote:
Well we do have a decent AI for CtP2, it's just wrapped up in various mods, which I get the feeling is where it's going to stay. But after all the original intention of the source code was only to fix bugs and improve moddability. If we can get Ages of Man (hopefully some other mods as well) working with the playtest and all bugs ironed out I'd say it's good enough.
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unfortunately Martin things the mod AI isn't devcent but cheats and etc. the other AI problem is the diplomacy. CTP2 diplomacy needs a serious rework and its yet another area I don't have the skill to improve. 
quote:
Do we know what Martin G is up to? If it looks like the code will stop being worked on soon (for whatever reasons), I suggest we try to wrap things up ASAP.
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I have no idea what he's up to, he has been slowing down regarding how much he does for ctp2. if he stays active I'd be encouraged to stay on. Fromafar seems to slowed down as well. Both have been doing minor cleanups and correcting me more than doing any major changes to the code since the last year almost 
quote:
As long as I'm visiting Apolyton I'll be around, but of course I don't contribute as much, certainly not to coding. |
you could help out by working with strategies.txt to get the barbarian to act normal (like no wonders, balance attack and siege). I still haven't figured out how to do that.
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Emperor
Monterrey, Mexico
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Jun 2001 time: 16:26
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quote: based on the condition of ctp2 I'm sure anyone knows what it was intended to be I won't be reverting back to ctp1 I was planning on using that color scheme to make new ggraphics, using stuff we see in current games like civ4 and civcity:rome where there is a fade in the buttons and stuff like that. On one hand I can do it and see what people think (by making it a mod) on the other hand if its not wanted I'm not going to expend the effort. |
Some of it is nice in CtP2, like the columns on the empire window, it has a nice theme IMO, except the science victory window, that's FUGLY 
Transparent/Faded buttons sounds cool though, be nice to see what that looks like, but not if it means more bugs at this stage...
quote: unfortunately Martin things the mod AI isn't devcent but cheats and etc. the other AI problem is the diplomacy. CTP2 diplomacy needs a serious rework and its yet another area I don't have the skill to improve.  |
There's no one here to fix the AI properly and (at least IMO) the AI in the mods can still be very good. Maybe it's time to just focus entirely on bug finding/fixing now. All the additions you've all made are a big improvement, but it's obvious things are slowing down so maybe now is the time to consolidate what we have. Unless Martin and Fromafar (or anyone else) come and tell us they're still working on the AI that is.
quote: you could help out by working with strategies.txt to get the barbarian to act normal (like no wonders, balance attack and siege). I still haven't figured out how to do that. |
That's something I've been messing with while playtesting. Different levels of barbs as well, to find the best balance between a fun challenge for the human and not killing the AI's chances in the first 50 turns.
All this depends on the activity of the rest of the project though. No point reporting if there's no one around to fix it.
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Moderator
Berlin, Germany
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Mar 2001 time: 23:26
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quote: Originally posted by E
unfortunately Martin things the mod AI isn't devcent but cheats and etc. |
That's indeed not fine, if you decide to play against a cheater then it is your problem. But otherwise it should play fair, it should use all the things you can use.
On another issure: There is something out there called real live. And I shouldn't devote all my time for CTP2, simply there is also something else.
For the merging code, if you really need something like this than please make it optional, so that I don't have to be bothered with it. Simply I like an AI that plays to the end-victory (or should I say Endsieg. ) of course this may not only end in the total war but also in the total defeat.
About the AI: This one is not so easy you have a lot of files and everywhere can be a little defect hidden, so you have to find it first. But one difficulty to find such defects is that you have no idea what you are looking for. Maybe you have a vague idea what it is like empty sea transporter, but you just may slip accitentally over it.
Another problem with the AI code is that it is hard to understand, those iterators aren't very intuitive. Actually you can only rework this AI, try to clean it up first, try to simplify it first, without changing the functionality first, in the hope that you may stumble over s | |
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